Models/actresses lot fatter in the 1950s?urban myth smashed

[Guest]

I hear this a lot from large women. They say that Marilyn Monroe was a size 16 and such nonsense. If its true; size 16 was a lot smaller then; as though we as a society have forced thiness on them through modern models.

 

Firstly let me say I have no objection to a woman being a size 00 or a size 28...its up to them; NOT me; NOT the state. But I don't like history being tampered with.

 

Now while I object to state interference in weight and size: for fat and thin alike; I also object to supermodels all the time being told they are bad role models. Where is the evidence? I don't see any thin women? My girlfirend sometimes gets abuse off people for being "anorexic" yet she isn't at all....she is a size 12 UK. She objected to some woman saying it the other day and she said "but I am a size 12". The woman turned round and said "I am a size 12 ; you are one of those 00s" . It wasn't a compliment; the woman was sour and insulting. She may have been a size 12 barrage balloon maybe.

One of our friends who did have anorexia usd to say its not THIN people that made me that way; its watching FAT people gorge"

 

Of course what has happened is that stores have copied the Marks and Spencers marketing con of making sies a size bigger to make people think they have slimmed down to a 14 so buy it. I bought my girlfriend and m and s size 10 jumper that is supposed to be tight fitting. It drowns her. Yet her meaurements are the same as they have been for 10 years...in fact she has gained half a stone since I met her.

 

Here are some things my girlfriend has gleaned going through some fifties mags;

 

A Frank Usher ad says

"availbale in sizes 36 and 38 inch hips only" As thought they DON'T want fatter people in their dresses.

 

The average waist size now is 34 inches. In 1952 it was 28 to 32 inch waist and THAT was considered necessary for you to wear a corset. Corsets actually started at 23 inches....22 was considered appropriate with corsets.

 

Quote from a foundation garment feature:

The average figure usually has a difference of 6 to 9 inches between bust and waist; and 9 to 10 inches between waist and hips"

 

Don't see much of that any more; remember this is English so it is slightly pear shaped. Now we appear to be barrel shaped...wtf happened?

 

There is an ad for a "special shop" discreetly placed in the back of a Vogue, for "women with hips over 42 inches.

 

It says also that if you add your hip and bust an waist size together it should be less than 100 unless you are a greedy individual.

 

The BIGGEST bra size advertised anywhere is size 38; size 32 was average. Average height was a little shorter than now but only an inch or two. There were still plenty of tall models.

 

 

 

 

Keep eating the chickens and burgers ladies; and the crap they are pumped with to make them fat ends up on your hips. And then th government blame it on to you; when really it is the way food giants have got away with this at the expense of real food.

[Guest]

Marilyn was indeed a size 12 to 14 given her bust measurement, however she was slimmer in her hips for that size, more of a 10 to 12. But remember peoples shapes and sizes continue to fluctuate through the years. (Marilyn's size fluctuated during her lifetime, but her measurements are most commonly given in the range of 36-24-34 to 38-23-36. (bust-waist-hips). Marilyn was 5' 5 and 1/2" tall and weighed 117 pounds when she died, according to the coroner's report. She wore a size 7 to 7 1/2 shoe. Her eyes were cornflower blue and her natural hair colour was reddish-brown. Taken from an official website)

 

As for clothes sizing they are based on the 50 percentile of collected anthropomorphic data, which is again under review because of our changing stature. To compound matters each clothing manufacture sets their own design standards, generally the more expensive the more liberal they are with material. According to the M&S size charts I'm a 10, but wear an 8 in skirts cos 10's are to big, same with Laura Ashley, only there I need a 12 in a dress.

 

If I shop American, my size will vary between a 2 and an 8 depending on label. Buying shoes is no easier. In the UK I'm a size 4 or 37, US can be 6, 6, 6.5, or 7.

 

Anorexic models is always a good topic. Firstly remember most of the new era of models are barely out of puberty. Gemma Ward hit the catwalk a few years ago at 14 yrs of age and she is 5' 10" tall of course she is going to look skinny, but not anorexic.

[Guest]

I also think its not how much you eat...or even waht and when you eat....its what is IN some things some people eat.

My girlfriend eats no meat.

I bet you don't eat huge amounts of meat Tryxie.

 

Also cheese. I bought this sheese this week from the local Spar. It is NOT chees. It is full of some other fat; gloopy fat. Peop eat that stuff.

 

Same as my mate eats three eggs for beakfast each day and reckoned all that free range stuff is crap. He ended up lactating from his nipples. He stopped eating th cheap eggs then.

 

Tryxie you eat loads of doughnuts but are really slim. So does my girlfriend.

 

As you say....look at Marliyns waist size. How many women have that waist size now?

 

Kebabs are huge source of excessive steroid pumped fat too.

 

sorry....wandering,,....need to sleep.

 

Good point about the models Tryxie too.

[Guest]

As you say....look at Marliyns waist size. How many women have that waist size now?

 

Yes, but very few actually wear girdles or corsets any more, unless you are a goth or fetish model. These garments were derigueur for the fashionable woman of the 50's and early 60's

[MadisonAvenueFurPrincess]

It is a shame that in 2007, you will not get a major job in the modeling industry if you are much more than a size 4, size 2 is more sought, much shorter than 5'9" tall and weigh at the most 130 lbs, more like 115lbs and the standard has loosened up a little. I have seen 100's of drop dead gorgeous girls as much as a size 12-14. I fell for this ideal and was once 105 lbs and a size 0. Thank God, I stopped modeling.

[Worker 11811]

I really don't like girls that are that skinny!

 

I'm not a chubby chaser or anything like that, either. But I like a woman that doesn't look like she'll break when I put my arms around her.

 

Y'Know... I like 'em with a little meat on their bones!

 

I'm glad you got out of that racket, Madison!

Not only is it bad for your body but that business wrecks peoples' minds. It just sucks the soul right out of a person.

 

Looking good and loving fashion are good things to do but, the modeling industry is too excessive.

 

You are better off to be in the NORMAL world again!

[Guest]

What I do not like is the assertion that the fashion indstry today is

 

1.Exploitative of the models. As Madison pointed out she got out of it. Then as Tryxie said they pick models who are already young therefore have thin bodies. If you are a designer you want to see your creation at its best. The girls are coathangers. There are plenty around who can pull that off without problem for a few years at least; no harm done to the bulk of them....certainly no call for the state to get involved and stop Esther Canadas working , and vilifying them.

 

2. Encouraging this massive social problem of dangerously thin women in society.....LOOK around! The vast majority of people are huge! I really noticed this in the Czech Republic after the velvet revolution. The vast majority of women were very thin. That was 10 years ago. Now they have changed to a mcDonalds and supermarket giant culture too and the women have ballooned.

 

In the 1950s yes corsetry was encouraged. BUT waist sizes were much much smaller. And hip and breast too.

 

There was a huge industry in corstery and all sorts of contraptions for making breasts appear larger and supported.

 

Then women burned their bras, and disgarded their corsets huh?

 

Well no; not exactly. Before this the lingerie industry became mass market. You can see the bigger players come into it with marketing above quality by the early 60s. They sold them this crap; and cheapness was the virtue.

 

The reason this corsetry and these fabulous bras are not available now is because the trade is small and specialist....and expensive.

That stuff takes a lot of money and time to produce.

People do not want to pay the equivalent of

[LordTheNightKnight]

The biggest thing I notice about the fashion industry is the lack of curves on the models. My friends and I think this is so designers can be lazy and not have to work with extra cuts and lines.

 

Seriously, a lot of clothes designers make are more cylinders than proper dresses.

[Guest]

Then you have noticed nothing about the fashion industry, nor have any knowledge of it.

Try looking at some of the Spring Summer collections from 2007, Amanda Wakeley, Balenciaga, Pucci, Gaultier, Valentino, Zuhair, to name a few, and see where you are wrong.

[Worker 11811]

I DO think the fashion and modeling industry is psychologically damaging to a large number of the women who are in it.

 

They take young, "emerging adult" women whose personalities haven't completely developed and place them into unusually stressful situations, day in and day out for several years. ANY type of continuous stress has detrimental effects on ANY person. On young, impressionable women, this effect is accentuated.

 

During this time, the women are constantly told to be conscious of their bodies. They must monitor their weight. They must change their hairstyles frequently. They wear different clothes and makeup on a daily basis. And, if ONE LITTLE HAIR is out of place, they catch hell for it. It's like living in Boot Camp on Paris Island, 24 hours per day for several years!

 

That kind of pressure would crush almost anybody!

 

I work in a place where there is a ballet school. I see the dancers throughout the year as they go to and from class. Several times during the season I have to help put on their dance recitals. The kind of pressure these girls are under is amazing!

 

You've got skinny, nearly anorexic young girls running around backstage in pointe shoes and spandex tights going nearly out of their minds with anticipation of their five minute routine on stage.

 

It can be a surreal experience!

 

This is not to say that EVERY person who goes into the fashion industry will be affected but I am saying that there are a lot of people who can only tolerate so much of it. There are some people who go on to great success in the industry. But there are ten times more people who are chewed up and spit out by the "machine".

 

You can say the same thing about professional sports stars. American football players and other sportsmen go through similar hardships. But, for every man who makes it to the Superbowl there are a million who don't.

 

There's nothing wrong with wanting to be a professional model. People just have to realize that things aren't all bright lights and beautiful people. I think Madison is smart to realize the truth of it and I think her decision to get out of the business while she still has her sanity is a good one.

[Guest]

Where is your evidence for this belief Worker?

 

Yes I think one or two have issues that have arisen from fame; but not from weight.

 

In fact; I personally know quite a few fashion models and don't know anyone that is psychologically dmaged through weight. In fact; most are older and have maintained a trim figure and some still model. They are among the soundest people I know. Mostly thy ar UK 6 to 8 size wise; but a couple are 10 / 12. My avatar has done a lot of fashion work. She is a 8/10 ; is sound and loves the job. Came out and stuffed her face on Indian with us three nights running and drank lots.

 

I was backstage at a show once and a reporter started asking the girls if they are ana or mia . The girls were screwing their faces up and saying "no" don't be ridiculous. One of the older models turfed him out; she siad it was a constant hassle like this . The models were all eating normally by the way; I had lunch there. They smoke a lot because they are sat around waiting for hours being made up; then it gets very tense when they are on. In the evning we went to a perty at a fashion tv cafe and again they ate normally; no throwing up or anything.

 

I don't know any that don't love what they do or have any psychological issues relating to weight.

 

Gia and Naomi and one or two others had some problems with addiction; but that is not to do with weight IMHO.

 

Now jockeys; that is a different matter.

 

They sometimes have to lose 10 lbs in a day to ride at a certain weight, Years of fasting at a clearly arteficial weight can have traumatic effects on the body later. They can get fat. But then again I know plenty who are not.

 

We are talking about MEN with incredible musculature riding at 7 stone. I don;t read anything in the media about that.

 

Keiron had an alcohol problem as he likes to socialise. Not eating much means the alcohol kicks in quick of course.

 

Typical models diet provided on a shoot :

 

Breakfast: grilled bacon sandwich; yoghurt, apple, juice

 

Lunch : avocado and asparagus salad; lime and mineral water

 

afternoon tea : scones and cream and tea

 

Dinner: arabiatta pasta and salad and half a bottle of wine. Campari and sodas before and after.

 

I was with my frind all day and night and that is what they all had provided for.

 

Now here is the average jockeys diet:

 

breakfast: nothing; not even water: sauna where they get rid of water to meet the weight.

 

lunch: two jaffa cakes

 

tea: an orange and a quarter of a sandwich crust removed.

 

Dinner: quarter of a piece of chicken and two slices of lettuce, tea no milk

 

No psychological damage.